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Post by Fletcher on Aug 24, 2016 13:23:27 GMT
It's always been my opinion that Democrats don't care about scandals if there's a big name involved. I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. I tend to agree with this approach. Scandals are definitely a warning into the character and integrity of the candidate, but since you can throw those concepts out the door for both of these candidates, you might as well decide based on who you think is going to do a better job.
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Post by Fletcher on Aug 24, 2016 13:34:42 GMT
As for cycling, I used to ride a lot in and around Denver, as I did triathlons for years. I almost always feel equally irritated by bad drivers and bad cyclists. And there were plenty of each. I had drivers put me in really dangerous situations and had to dive off the bike once to avoid being hit in an intersection while I had a green light (left hand turn, right in front of me). I also can't believe the cyclists that weave through traffic illegally and blow through stop signs. Assholes are assholes. I think I sympathize a little more with the cyclists, just because they are so, so vulnerable out there.
I crashed in a race 5 years ago, while going 40mph. That was it for me. No more road biking. I had to take a month off of work, have two surgeries, and the road rash was disgusting. I don't ever want to hit asphalt like that again. Too old to bounce back. I know so few regular cyclists that haven't been through a significant accident. If I was back on the rural roads of Western Massachusetts, maybe I would still ride. It's too dangerous for me in the city/urban suburbs, and the drivers are too distracted/angry/careless.
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Post by islamorada on Aug 24, 2016 13:38:07 GMT
It's always been my opinion that Democrats don't care about scandals if there's a big name involved. I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. Weapons of Mass Deception..... there never should have been a war in the first place. We are still paying for it in lives lost. A war in Afghanistan, yup all for it. As for Bill, he deserved all the crap, although I could care what he does sexually. He does make himself vulnerable to all of us when he acts impulsively. Obama, will go down as another President who created debt and continued to bail out corporations/banks to save the global economy. Economic stimulus of the bureaucracy! Yahoo! I'm still hedging, Clinton does not like the media, but she is far smarter than Trump right now with the media. Donald needs to start hammering on the pseudo economy, unemployment stats are slanted, underemployed is a real problem. Ok I am going to vote for Trump. At least he will swing at the issues and make the public aware.
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Post by bostonfan191646 on Aug 24, 2016 13:45:36 GMT
I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. that's very true, but there was a steady stream of bullshit about the WMDs. My favorite was the video they showed of the plane that was being developed by the Iraqis to deploy anthrax, too bad it was a plane that had been retired a decade prior.
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Post by bostonfan191646 on Aug 24, 2016 13:47:48 GMT
I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. Weapons of Mass Deception..... there never should have been a war in the first place. We are still paying for it in lives lost. A war in Afghanistan, yup all for it. As for Bill, he deserved all the crap, although I could care what he does sexually. He does make himself vulnerable to all of us when he acts impulsively. Obama, will go down as another President who created debt and continued to bail out corporations/banks to save the global economy. Economic stimulus of the bureaucracy! Yahoo! I'm still hedging, Clinton does not like the media, but she is far smarter than Trump right now with the media. Donald needs to start hammering on the pseudo economy, unemployment stats are slanted, underemployed is a real problem. Ok I am going to vote for Trump. At least he will swing at the issues and make the public aware. I'm not sure he'll be on the ballot
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2016 15:51:05 GMT
Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. That's exactly what happened. Also WMD's were found and this didn't come to public light until 10-12 years after the war started. The media has, as you would expect, buried this inconvenient fact or spun it as "no new WMD's were found". The intelligence community knew they existed but weren't able to produce the hard evidence at the time they pushed for the invasion so they acted as if they had the proof. W was not our best or brightest president but he was one of our most honest ones. I don't think he lied, but his judgment sucked and the nation building, to borrow a Trumpism, was a disaster.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2016 16:18:47 GMT
I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. Weapons of Mass Deception..... there never should have been a war in the first place. We are still paying for it in lives lost. A war in Afghanistan, yup all for it. As for Bill, he deserved all the crap, although I could care what he does sexually. He does make himself vulnerable to all of us when he acts impulsively. Obama, will go down as another President who created debt and continued to bail out corporations/banks to save the global economy. Economic stimulus of the bureaucracy! Yahoo! I'm still hedging, Clinton does not like the media, but she is far smarter than Trump right now with the media. Donald needs to start hammering on the pseudo economy, unemployment stats are slanted, underemployed is a real problem. Ok I am going to vote for Trump. At least he will swing at the issues and make the public aware. This is where I've been at for awhile with Trump, I'm taking my chances. Clinton, scandals removed, is lousy at best. She sucked as a Senator and was worse as SoS. If Trump can build the wall and bring some of that trade money back into America I'll be satisfied. The Clintons are stuck in the 90s. With the internet, news cycle, and hackers/Assange these days, they can't enrich themselves through their offices without the public knowing. A Clinton Presidency will be one scandal and distraction after another. When your husband tells the most syrupy speech about your record at the DNC and the best accomplishment he lists is putting guidance counselors in elementary schools thirty years ago, you kind of suck at the whole politics thing.
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Post by bostonfan191646 on Aug 24, 2016 16:33:59 GMT
Weapons of Mass Deception..... there never should have been a war in the first place. We are still paying for it in lives lost. A war in Afghanistan, yup all for it. As for Bill, he deserved all the crap, although I could care what he does sexually. He does make himself vulnerable to all of us when he acts impulsively. Obama, will go down as another President who created debt and continued to bail out corporations/banks to save the global economy. Economic stimulus of the bureaucracy! Yahoo! I'm still hedging, Clinton does not like the media, but she is far smarter than Trump right now with the media. Donald needs to start hammering on the pseudo economy, unemployment stats are slanted, underemployed is a real problem. Ok I am going to vote for Trump. At least he will swing at the issues and make the public aware. This is where I've been at for awhile with Trump, I'm taking my chances. Clinton, scandals removed, is lousy at best. She sucked as a Senator and was worse as SoS. If Trump can build the wall and bring some of that trade money back into America I'll be satisfied. The Clintons are stuck in the 90s. With the internet, news cycle, and hackers/Assange these days, they can't enrich themselves through their offices without the public knowing. A Clinton Presidency will be one scandal and distraction after another. When your husband tells the most syrupy speech about your record at the DNC and the best accomplishment he lists is putting guidance counselors in elementary schools thirty years ago, you kind of suck at the whole politics thing. Building that ridiculous wall would bankrupt the country. No, Mexico isn't paying for it. That's beyond absurd. If the wall goes up, I think I'm exploring living opportunities in different countries. Politics aside, just trumps general demeanor turns out country into an international laughing stock were he to win the election. He doesn't want to be president, he needs to just duck out so a real candidate like paul Ryan can take his place.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2016 16:41:23 GMT
This is where I've been at for awhile with Trump, I'm taking my chances. Clinton, scandals removed, is lousy at best. She sucked as a Senator and was worse as SoS. If Trump can build the wall and bring some of that trade money back into America I'll be satisfied. The Clintons are stuck in the 90s. With the internet, news cycle, and hackers/Assange these days, they can't enrich themselves through their offices without the public knowing. A Clinton Presidency will be one scandal and distraction after another. When your husband tells the most syrupy speech about your record at the DNC and the best accomplishment he lists is putting guidance counselors in elementary schools thirty years ago, you kind of suck at the whole politics thing. Building that ridiculous wall would bankrupt the country. No, Mexico isn't paying for it. That's beyond absurd. If the wall goes up, I think I'm exploring living opportunities in different countries. Politics aside, just trumps general demeanor turns out country into an international laughing stock were he to win the election. He doesn't want to be president, he needs to just duck out so a real candidate like paul Ryan can take his place. Paul Ryan is a clown. He's a budget idealogue with no solutions. A budget impresario that's presided over the spending of five trillion dollars. Fuck, I can vote Democrat and get that.
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Post by badhabitude on Aug 24, 2016 17:52:24 GMT
Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. That's exactly what happened. Also WMD's were found and this didn't come to public light until 10-12 years after the war started. The media has, as you would expect, buried this inconvenient fact or spun it as "no new WMD's were found". The intelligence community knew they existed but weren't able to produce the hard evidence at the time they pushed for the invasion so they acted as if they had the proof. W was not our best or brightest president but he was one of our most honest ones. A part of this depends on what you consider WMDs. After all we *know* he used gas on the Kurds, that's a WMD, ain't it? Anyways, Trump really scares me. I think he's already done irreparable harm to our political system by lowering the bar with all of the insane talk and especially the "cheating at elections" nonsense. There has been no credible evidence of enough "cheaters" to make a difference and on a practical level, how could you ever get enough voting cheating to happen to make a difference? It would have to be an ENORMOUS conspiracy, so enormous it would be blatant and easily uncovered. This "cheating" talk, especially since the election hasn't even happened it really troublesome to me, and these "voting monitors" or whatever are more troubling still, this could invite violence at polling places. In any event, I am quite concerned about American politics taking a giant step back.
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Post by badhabitude on Aug 24, 2016 18:02:09 GMT
As for cycling, I used to ride a lot in and around Denver, as I did triathlons for years. I almost always feel equally irritated by bad drivers and bad cyclists. And there were plenty of each. I had drivers put me in really dangerous situations and had to dive off the bike once to avoid being hit in an intersection while I had a green light (left hand turn, right in front of me). I also can't believe the cyclists that weave through traffic illegally and blow through stop signs. Assholes are assholes. I think I sympathize a little more with the cyclists, just because they are so, so vulnerable out there. I crashed in a race 5 years ago, while going 40mph. That was it for me. No more road biking. I had to take a month off of work, have two surgeries, and the road rash was disgusting. I don't ever want to hit asphalt like that again. Too old to bounce back. I know so few regular cyclists that haven't been through a significant accident. If I was back on the rural roads of Western Massachusetts, maybe I would still ride. It's too dangerous for me in the city/urban suburbs, and the drivers are too distracted/angry/careless. Fletch, see my earlier post, I encountered my worst car/cyclist incidents WEST or about route 128. Otherwise as an inexperienced rider I got car-doored in Harvard Square - before I learned how to ride in city traffic. My racing days ended back in the late 90's when I crashed in a corner, saw my my kneecap through the hole in my skin, about 30 external stitches and I don't know how many internal stitches. I was hauling ass and I'm sure it was at least 45 mph, road rash from my left wrist down to my left ankle and everything in between.
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Post by bookboy007 on Aug 24, 2016 18:47:50 GMT
Honestly, I don't think Schultz really had any effect on the primary, but if she did, I wouldn't really care. If I was high up in the DNC I would have said from day one we need to make sure Bernie isn't our candidate, that's the best way to lose the election. There's actually a lot of democrats that I think are kinda slimy, but are really good elected officials. I think Hilary will be added to that list. I think she's an abrasive bitch, and I wouldn't want to have a beer with her, but I think she'll do a really good job as president for one term. I'd want to have a beer with her husband but I'm worried a drink might kill him It's always been my opinion that Democrats don't care about scandals if there's a big name involved. Republicans are partly to blame for not picking their battles. Too much wasted political capital on non-issues or trumped up issues like fluids on an intern's dress, not realizing that this plays to the moral majority that's already their base, while most of the undecided and Dem voters "like the fact their President likes sex." Less concern over peckers might have kept the outrage over unethical political behaviour more pure; people are sensitized to scandal and don't see the distinction between gerrymandering and fucking an intern any more.
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Post by bookboy007 on Aug 24, 2016 18:52:13 GMT
Building that ridiculous wall would bankrupt the country. No, Mexico isn't paying for it. That's beyond absurd. If the wall goes up, I think I'm exploring living opportunities in different countries. Politics aside, just trumps general demeanor turns out country into an international laughing stock were he to win the election. He doesn't want to be president, he needs to just duck out so a real candidate like paul Ryan can take his place. Paul Ryan is a clown. He's a budget idealogue with no solutions. A budget impresario that's presided over the spending of five trillion dollars. Fuck, I can vote Democrat and get that. Objectivism is the philosophy upper middle class high school students would create if you could milk them all, ferment the milk, and sculpt a small, dark European woman who looks vaguely like a Picasso painting to write it down.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2016 20:07:24 GMT
Paul Ryan is a clown. He's a budget idealogue with no solutions. A budget impresario that's presided over the spending of five trillion dollars. Fuck, I can vote Democrat and get that. Objectivism is the philosophy upper middle class high school students would create if you could milk them all, ferment the milk, and sculpt a small, dark European woman who looks vaguely like a Picasso painting to write it down. Conservatives like myself were really banking on Ryan and Mitch McConnell to roll back the budget, repeal the failing Obamacare and generally be a thorn in Obama's side and it hasn't happened. Paul Ryan has spent more time fighting Donald Trump than Obama.
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Post by badhabitude on Aug 24, 2016 20:45:19 GMT
Objectivism is the philosophy upper middle class high school students would create if you could milk them all, ferment the milk, and sculpt a small, dark European woman who looks vaguely like a Picasso painting to write it down. Conservatives like myself were really banking on Ryan and Mitch McConnell to roll back the budget, repeal the failing Obamacare and generally be a thorn in Obama's side and it hasn't happened. Paul Ryan has spent more time fighting Donald Trump than Obama. re: Paul Ryan. It's called being responsible.
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Post by UtahGetMeTwo on Aug 24, 2016 21:13:30 GMT
I certainly feel that way for the most part. If a candidate is the best for the job, I really don't give a shit about the scandals. I didn't care about slick Willie getting a blow job, but I did care about him lying under oath. I don't particularly care about W sort of going AWOL when he was younger, but I do care about lying about the WMDs. I don't care about trumps tax returns, I care about his policies. Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. It was a big lie there never was any WMDs. Stop!
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Post by UtahGetMeTwo on Aug 24, 2016 21:16:55 GMT
I also think Paul Ryan will get legislature moving like Gingrich.
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Post by walktheline on Aug 24, 2016 22:13:26 GMT
Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. It was a big lie there never was any WMDs. Stop! My nephew on my wife's side did 2 tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. He was a bomb disposal expert. His unit was one of the ones who was called in to dispose of chemical weapons in Iraq. He's a hard core democrat with no reason to lie. There absolutely were WMD's in Iraq.
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Post by sportsnut on Aug 24, 2016 22:28:22 GMT
Whoa. Step back. There is nothing that points to W lying about WMD's. Sure, they didn't find them, but it's possible that the trucks leaving Iraq had them. It's also possible that W was lied to and spoke with plausible deniability. It was a big lie there never was any WMDs. Stop! Except there were. Maybe no active assembly lines producing the stuff, but plenty of WMD were found in Iraq.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2016 0:17:07 GMT
I also think Paul Ryan will get legislature moving like Gingrich. He's a hack. The Republican Party has a problem with Tokenism. Look at Little Marco. Ryan has been foisted to the front of the party to make the GOP look younger. He, and the other House Republicans, don't have the courage to play hard ball with Obama. Barry and the media play modern day Republicans like a fiddle. Newt shut down the government and impeached Clinton (while having a hypocritical affair of his own) these chumps passed the buck on Obamacare to the SC and spent five trillion dollars. I guess Trump is allowing Brexit impresario Nigel Farrage speak at a rally. Who's next, Razor Ramon?
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Post by NAS on Aug 25, 2016 2:24:26 GMT
It was a big lie there never was any WMDs. Stop! My nephew on my wife's side did 2 tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. He was a bomb disposal expert. His unit was one of the ones who was called in to dispose of chemical weapons in Iraq. He's a hard core democrat with no reason to lie. There absolutely were WMD's in Iraq. And that will cork the subject nicely.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2016 3:32:41 GMT
This big hub bub today is Pharma Super Bastards Mylan charging outrageous prices for Epi Pens. An issue I know well...however, the only number that beats how many price hikes they've had (17) in the past eight years are the CEO salaries bla bla bla.
I bring this up because Fat Potato Hilary jumps on the outrage bandwagon, the problem being that Mylan works with the Clinton Foundation and has given them something like a half a million dollars. My inner Tony Marinaro went off reading that, a cracked, whinging pseudo Italian wuss voice. "Is. This. A joke?!"
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Post by UtahGetMeTwo on Aug 25, 2016 4:45:21 GMT
It was a big lie there never was any WMDs. Stop! My nephew on my wife's side did 2 tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. He was a bomb disposal expert. His unit was one of the ones who was called in to dispose of chemical weapons in Iraq. He's a hard core democrat with no reason to lie. There absolutely were WMD's in Iraq. Hussein used chemical weapons on his own people in 88'-89', we know that. No one is denying that Hussein had "chemical weapons". The US public already new Iraq used chemical weapons on Kurds and Iran. When Cheney said "Hussein has attained WMDs", he meant nuclear warheads meant to be used on other Middle Eastern countries. Don't get it twisted and try to lop the two together. Not going cut it but nice try. Cheney is a war profiteer, scumbag!
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Post by NAS on Aug 25, 2016 5:24:50 GMT
My nephew on my wife's side did 2 tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. He was a bomb disposal expert. His unit was one of the ones who was called in to dispose of chemical weapons in Iraq. He's a hard core democrat with no reason to lie. There absolutely were WMD's in Iraq. Hussein used chemical weapons on his own people in 88'-89', we know that. No one is denying that Hussein had "chemical weapons". The US public already new Iraq used chemical weapons on Kurds and Iran. When Cheney said "Hussein has attained WMDs", he meant nuclear warheads meant to be used on other Middle Eastern countries. Don't get it twisted and try to lop the two together. Not going cut it but nice try. Cheney is a war profiteer, scumbag! I never heard nukes in the convo. Come on.
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Post by walktheline on Aug 25, 2016 12:05:10 GMT
My nephew on my wife's side did 2 tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. He was a bomb disposal expert. His unit was one of the ones who was called in to dispose of chemical weapons in Iraq. He's a hard core democrat with no reason to lie. There absolutely were WMD's in Iraq. Hussein used chemical weapons on his own people in 88'-89', we know that. No one is denying that Hussein had "chemical weapons". The US public already new Iraq used chemical weapons on Kurds and Iran. When Cheney said "Hussein has attained WMDs", he meant nuclear warheads meant to be used on other Middle Eastern countries. Don't get it twisted and try to lop the two together. Not going cut it but nice try. Cheney is a war profiteer, scumbag! San, I'm not trying to justify the war or defend cheney. The UN and the US were quite sure that saddam did not have a nuclear program. Nobody thought or said Iraq had nukes. The WMD's were always a convo about chemical and biological weapons. Saddam used them, as you said, in the 80's. The UN oversaw the disarmament subsequent to the first gulf war but did not find all the WMD's at the time. Intelligence found evidence that Iraq still had chemical weapons but couldn't pinpoint where they were. Shaky premise to go to war on IMO but it happened. The WMD's were old, leftover stockpiles that were in some case successfully hidden from the UN inspectors and in some cases there were chemical weapons that not even the Iraqis knew where they were. They had lost track of some of them. In any event, these WMD's were eventually found and disposed of during the second gulf war.
There has been an argument that after the first gulf war, Iraq had no WMD's. That simply wasn't true. There was another argument that Iraq had an active WMD's program but that is also not true. They had WMD's but they were all leftovers that saddam either hid or misplaced.
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