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Post by dannycater on Dec 25, 2023 0:21:08 GMT
Kind of hard to criticize a head coach who has had pretty darn great reg. season success and even after a slump team is 19-7-6...I addressed the what they need to fix....it's not the coach...he gave a pep talk to Lauko that got him going, he asked Shattenkirk to do more--he immediately activated offensively...and while I don't always agree with his lines (I had similar issue with stubborness of Cassidy until the day he finally, mercifully broke up Perfection Line and team blasted in January of his final season), I think he is a good coach. I have nothing to tell me he is not...Sweeney didn't replace guys, he put in some placeholders and assorted low budget guys (who have actually been very good), but Sweeney has done great things with this team...the playoff success or lack thereof points back to choking in 2019, and choking in 2013...two times where the Cup was that close to be had. Still, you have to make the playoffs and Monty/Sweeney don't give me any reason to feel otherwise as far as that is concerned. The team is playoff makeable. I'm not rose-colored, I said there are 3 players that all but need to go based on their lack of helping the squad be better--Lindholm, DeBrusk, Gryz--but both 27 and 74 did well in the past and were big parts of the B's even last year....there fall-off is monumental bad and so is the sporadic play of the Concussed #1 D--McAvoy--who gets hit in the head almost every game. He is going to be a concern going further. Still, you can bring up Merk, you can let Lohrei play more, you can hope the goalies keep up their stellar play and bring in offense. But firing Sweeney/Monty isn't going to miraculously turn the current team into something you or others are hoping for. They need a few changes and that we all can agree on--but it's personnel, not coaching and GM has been saddled by a Cap that prevented him from blindly signing a higher-priced free agent. It's 20-20 hindsight they fucked up in not moving 74 at his highest sell, but I think when B's signed Lindholm long term, they had no idea he would turn into these scared, pussy who is now a weak version of Carlo. Firing Montgomery right now is something a younger version of Lou Lamoriello might do, but not the Bruins. Like you said, the team is 19-7-6. So Dr. Evil will get his chance to fix what's wrong. I agree however with Book that Montgomery failed last spring when they hit adversity. And nite is right, the team is totally out of sync. Everybody has made solid points, even nite, but Monty's overall record as B's head coach is right up there with the best ever at the start of a coaching era---you don't get that way simply on players. You have to be able to coach the team and motivate the team...too much has been placed on Monty's failure during the Florida series...It would be basically Sinden firing guys with 100 point seasons or after a good playoff year (did that a few times), it's panic. Pure panic and the B's don't need to panic. Heck, even stevegm said (echoing Marchand himself) you have to compete. Team hasn't last several games, or certainly not enough. They will though and Monty will right the ship. It's ok to have adversity. This franchise right now needs that a bit. All the Cup teams had some adversity going back to at least after the Oilers/Pens/Wings..and even those teams had some seasons where they wanted to fire the coach or the GM. It's time-honored tradition to scapegoat.
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Post by bookboy007 on Dec 25, 2023 2:25:56 GMT
Firing Montgomery right now is something a younger version of Lou Lamoriello might do, but not the Bruins. Like you said, the team is 19-7-6. So Dr. Evil will get his chance to fix what's wrong. I agree however with Book that Montgomery failed last spring when they hit adversity. And nite is right, the team is totally out of sync. Everybody has made solid points, even nite, but Monty's overall record as B's head coach is right up there with the best ever at the start of a coaching era---you don't get that way simply on players. You have to be able to coach the team and motivate the team...too much has been placed on Monty's failure during the Florida series...It would be basically Sinden firing guys with 100 point seasons or after a good playoff year (did that a few times), it's panic. Pure panic and the B's don't need to panic. Heck, even stevegm said (echoing Marchand himself) you have to compete. Team hasn't last several games, or certainly not enough. They will though and Monty will right the ship. It's ok to have adversity. This franchise right now needs that a bit. All the Cup teams had some adversity going back to at least after the Oilers/Pens/Wings..and even those teams had some seasons where they wanted to fire the coach or the GM. It's time-honored tradition to scapegoat. Montgomery needs to do more than play with house money like he did last year. I disagree with nite - they were this discombobulated when DK retired. Some of the worst hockey I have seen the play since Dave Lewis. Cassidy figured it out. Time for Monty to do the same if he's capable.
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Post by mdsizzle on Dec 25, 2023 2:40:51 GMT
Everybody has made solid points, even nite, but Monty's overall record as B's head coach is right up there with the best ever at the start of a coaching era---you don't get that way simply on players. You have to be able to coach the team and motivate the team...too much has been placed on Monty's failure during the Florida series...It would be basically Sinden firing guys with 100 point seasons or after a good playoff year (did that a few times), it's panic. Pure panic and the B's don't need to panic. Heck, even stevegm said (echoing Marchand himself) you have to compete. Team hasn't last several games, or certainly not enough. They will though and Monty will right the ship. It's ok to have adversity. This franchise right now needs that a bit. All the Cup teams had some adversity going back to at least after the Oilers/Pens/Wings..and even those teams had some seasons where they wanted to fire the coach or the GM. It's time-honored tradition to scapegoat. Montgomery needs to do more than play with house money like he did last year. I disagree with nite - they were this discombobulated when DK retired. Some of the worst hockey I have seen the play since Dave Lewis. Cassidy figured it out. Time for Monty to do the same if he's capable. I would have liked Monty to try and recreate the BLIH with Potsi centering 63 and 88, or something a bit more exciting and creative than what we have seen to date, but largely he can only work with the bargain basement additions to a group with only a handful of talented guys... The rest are passengers and part 9f the problem, not the solution... When they go, Monty will look like a better coach... Until then he's a chef under pressure to prepare gourmet meals with potted meat and ketchup.
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Post by dannycater on Dec 25, 2023 2:43:43 GMT
Everybody has made solid points, even nite, but Monty's overall record as B's head coach is right up there with the best ever at the start of a coaching era---you don't get that way simply on players. You have to be able to coach the team and motivate the team...too much has been placed on Monty's failure during the Florida series...It would be basically Sinden firing guys with 100 point seasons or after a good playoff year (did that a few times), it's panic. Pure panic and the B's don't need to panic. Heck, even stevegm said (echoing Marchand himself) you have to compete. Team hasn't last several games, or certainly not enough. They will though and Monty will right the ship. It's ok to have adversity. This franchise right now needs that a bit. All the Cup teams had some adversity going back to at least after the Oilers/Pens/Wings..and even those teams had some seasons where they wanted to fire the coach or the GM. It's time-honored tradition to scapegoat. Montgomery needs to do more than play with house money like he did last year. I disagree with nite - they were this discombobulated when DK retired. Some of the worst hockey I have seen the play since Dave Lewis. Cassidy figured it out. Time for Monty to do the same if he's capable. So what you're saying is you wish Cassidy wasn't fired.
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Post by MrHulot on Dec 25, 2023 3:02:15 GMT
Montgomery needs to do more than play with house money like he did last year. I disagree with nite - they were this discombobulated when DK retired. Some of the worst hockey I have seen the play since Dave Lewis. Cassidy figured it out. Time for Monty to do the same if he's capable. So what you're saying is you wish Cassidy wasn't fired. I don't think anybody's saying that at all. But I think almost everybody was shocked when Cassidy was fired. So it may not be so much longing for Butch's return or a change in history. I'm not ashamed to admit that I was on a real "Monty high" last season - but only until game 5 of the playoffs, and even then I didn't think that they could blow it. Montgomery needs to fix what's wrong with this year's team, and it's definitely about attitude and structure, not about how much skill the team has.
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Post by RichHillOntario on Dec 25, 2023 4:36:58 GMT
Right now, whatever the coach's strategy is, the Bruins either aren't committed enough to consistently playing it or are, as presently constructed, incapable of producing what is required to make the strategy work.
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Post by nitelite on Dec 25, 2023 4:40:53 GMT
Kind of hard to criticize a head coach who has had pretty darn great reg. season success and even after a slump team is 19-7-6...I addressed the what they need to fix....it's not the coach...he gave a pep talk to Lauko that got him going, he asked Shattenkirk to do more--he immediately activated offensively...and while I don't always agree with his lines (I had similar issue with stubborness of Cassidy until the day he finally, mercifully broke up Perfection Line and team blasted in January of his final season), I think he is a good coach. I have nothing to tell me he is not...Sweeney didn't replace guys, he put in some placeholders and assorted low budget guys (who have actually been very good), but Sweeney has done great things with this team...the playoff success or lack thereof points back to choking in 2019, and choking in 2013...two times where the Cup was that close to be had. Still, you have to make the playoffs and Monty/Sweeney don't give me any reason to feel otherwise as far as that is concerned. The team is playoff makeable. I'm not rose-colored, I said there are 3 players that all but need to go based on their lack of helping the squad be better--Lindholm, DeBrusk, Gryz--but both 27 and 74 did well in the past and were big parts of the B's even last year....there fall-off is monumental bad and so is the sporadic play of the Concussed #1 D--McAvoy--who gets hit in the head almost every game. He is going to be a concern going further. Still, you can bring up Merk, you can let Lohrei play more, you can hope the goalies keep up their stellar play and bring in offense. But firing Sweeney/Monty isn't going to miraculously turn the current team into something you or others are hoping for. They need a few changes and that we all can agree on--but it's personnel, not coaching and GM has been saddled by a Cap that prevented him from blindly signing a higher-priced free agent. It's 20-20 hindsight they fucked up in not moving 74 at his highest sell, but I think when B's signed Lindholm long term, they had no idea he would turn into these scared, pussy who is now a weak version of Carlo. Firing Montgomery right now is something a younger version of Lou Lamoriello might do, but not the Bruins. Like you said, the team is 19-7-6. So Dr. Evil will get his chance to fix what's wrong. I agree however with Book that Montgomery failed last spring when they hit adversity. And nite is right, the team is totally out of sync. I don't think JM is going anywhere this season. That wasn't what I was saying. I was saying that there's a possibility he could be replaced & listed reasons why. He's going to get the opportunity to right his own mess, but unless this team starts playing a different & better brand of hockey JM WONT be back next season if they collapse into the "miss the playoffs abyess!". There's a lot of talk Joel Quinnvielle maybe available next season.
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Post by MrHulot on Dec 25, 2023 18:03:57 GMT
I think the word you're looking for is tailspin. They are in a tailspin. The break may help. But it may not. Getting a centre will not help. You could drop Nate Mackinnon in and it would not help. The team game is crumbly. Marchand is a terrible captain. All the things that were raised when it was still in question are coming through now. He is a great voice in the room but not the guy to reinforce the team commitment, coaches' messages etc. and he is useless in game as a leader. He's also 0-0-0 at even strength in the last five games when they need him most. Montgomery has never had this challenge as a coach before. He got his start with a Dallas team in transition and made them better; last year he took a good Bruins team, and steered a stedy course until they hit adversity and then he had no answers. I won't be surprised if he loses the job at the end if the year if they miss the playoffs. Absolutely agree. I had a bad feeling when Marchand went back to his old tricks with his stupid move on Kaprisov just before the end of period one. Childish, selfish, bonehead move. Not what I expect from a team captain. That sent a bad signal to the rest of the team, consciously or subconsciously, and from the second period on, the team's overall performance was abysmal.
Montgomery likes to play softies like his old pal Heinen and give them way too much ice time, while he sits JvR or Lohrei. Go figure.
Probably way too much of a players' coach. He should have kicked Ullmark out of the crease in the playoffs when it was obvious that something was wrong. He's the coach, he makes those decisions. Not Ullmark, not Bergeron, not Marchand.
Nobody wanted to see Tortorella behind the Bruins bench. But now the Flyers are playing much better than anybody expected. They may not have two top-notch goalies, but that team fought back from being 1-5 down and almost won that game. I just watched the recap of the Flyers @ Red Wings game.
The Flyers had guys in front of Reimer for each of their goals. Every time Philly got into the Detroit end, one Flyer immediately skated to the crease. That's what I've been missing when I watched the Bruins of late. The team had been advertised as bigger, more physical and hard to play against. BS. No Looch plus softies galore - bush league teams could take them right now.
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Post by 50belowzero on Dec 25, 2023 21:58:22 GMT
Firing Montgomery right now is something a younger version of Lou Lamoriello might do, but not the Bruins. Like you said, the team is 19-7-6. So Dr. Evil will get his chance to fix what's wrong. I agree however with Book that Montgomery failed last spring when they hit adversity. And nite is right, the team is totally out of sync. I don't think JM is going anywhere this season. That wasn't what I was saying. I was saying that there's a possibility he could be replaced & listed reasons why. He's going to get the opportunity to right his own mess, but unless this team starts playing a different & better brand of hockey JM WONT be back next season if they collapse into the "miss the playoffs abyess!". There's a lot of talk Joel Quinnvielle maybe available next season. I personally don't think you'll see Quenneville coaching the Bruins at any time, maybe TO but not the B's.
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Post by MrHulot on Dec 26, 2023 2:53:17 GMT
I don't think JM is going anywhere this season. That wasn't what I was saying. I was saying that there's a possibility he could be replaced & listed reasons why. He's going to get the opportunity to right his own mess, but unless this team starts playing a different & better brand of hockey JM WONT be back next season if they collapse into the "miss the playoffs abyess!". There's a lot of talk Joel Quinnvielle maybe available next season. I personally don't think you'll see Quenneville coaching the Bruins at any time, maybe TO but not the B's. Well, it appears that Montgomery has fought back successfully against alcoholism, I hope he's also capable of adapting and being more than just a very popular coach in the locker room.
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Post by 50belowzero on Dec 26, 2023 5:00:05 GMT
I personally don't think you'll see Quenneville coaching the Bruins at any time, maybe TO but not the B's. Well, it appears that Montgomery has fought back successfully against alcoholism, I hope he's also capable of adapting and being more than just a very popular coach in the locker room.We'll see, i doubt Boston will be Montgomery's last stop, he's just starting out as a professional NHL coach, these guys have 9 lives.
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Post by zamboni24 on Dec 26, 2023 13:51:48 GMT
Lot of people jumping ship in here....good, jump off...Go B's! Touche’ — short and to the point. I’ve been all in for over 60 years — why bail out now !!
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Post by bookboy007 on Dec 27, 2023 4:50:50 GMT
Montgomery needs to do more than play with house money like he did last year. I disagree with nite - they were this discombobulated when DK retired. Some of the worst hockey I have seen the play since Dave Lewis. Cassidy figured it out. Time for Monty to do the same if he's capable. So what you're saying is you wish Cassidy wasn't fired. Nope. I'm saying they fired a guy who figured it out so the new guy should take that into consideration when pondering his job security.
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Post by bookboy007 on Dec 27, 2023 6:11:30 GMT
Right now, whatever the coach's strategy is, the Bruins either aren't committed enough to consistently playing it or are, as presently constructed, incapable of producing what is required to make the strategy work. The coach is responsible for structure. The structure is crumbling. 15 years of habit kept it in place, but now the coach needs to expend some energy to shore it up. He failed at that last year. When they cracked against the Panthers, he had no answer. I have periodically been critical of Marchand and i was critical if Pastrnak when he arrived. Shupe was the most vocal about the sucking for PPs and lately we are back to this team needing the PP to score. The biggest question for this season was who leads and how well. Now we find out.
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Post by bookboy007 on Dec 27, 2023 6:13:58 GMT
I think the word you're looking for is tailspin. They are in a tailspin. The break may help. But it may not. Getting a centre will not help. You could drop Nate Mackinnon in and it would not help. The team game is crumbly. Marchand is a terrible captain. All the things that were raised when it was still in question are coming through now. He is a great voice in the room but not the guy to reinforce the team commitment, coaches' messages etc. and he is useless in game as a leader. He's also 0-0-0 at even strength in the last five games when they need him most. Montgomery has never had this challenge as a coach before. He got his start with a Dallas team in transition and made them better; last year he took a good Bruins team, and steered a stedy course until they hit adversity and then he had no answers. I won't be surprised if he loses the job at the end if the year if they miss the playoffs. Other than them being in a tailspin, most of this is silly. Obviously McKinnon would help. Probably make them the best team in the League. Monty does need to earn his Christmas bonus and fix it. That's nice on paper. Right now, I think there's as 50/50 chance they all stand there and wait for Nate the Saviour to fix it. Which he wouldn't.
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Post by MrHulot on Dec 29, 2023 1:01:19 GMT
Right now, whatever the coach's strategy is, the Bruins either aren't committed enough to consistently playing it or are, as presently constructed, incapable of producing what is required to make the strategy work. The coach is responsible for structure. The structure is crumbling. 15 years of habit kept it in place, but now the coach needs to expend some energy to shore it up. He failed at that last year. When they cracked against the Panthers, he had no answer. I have periodically been critical of Marchand and i was critical if Pastrnak when he arrived. Shupe was the most vocal about the sucking for PPs and lately we are back to this team needing the PP to score. The biggest question for this season was who leads and how well. Now we find out. They had three PP goals out of four last night, against a bad team. Anson Carter said they played "textbook hockey for 60 minutes", but they only scored once 5-on-5 when Lohrei pinched.
The games on Saturday, Sunday and Tuesday should tell us more. Three teams who are currently not in a playoff spot, but each has beaten the Bruins already this season (the game in Columbus was particularly bad).
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